The Power of Intuition in Show Business: A Conversation with Sid Ganis

Welcome to the Heart of Show business. I am your host, alexia Melochi. I believe in great storytelling and that every successful artist has a deep desire to express something from the heart to create a ripple effect in our society. Emotion and entertainment are closely tied together. My guests and I want to give you insider access to how the film, television and music industry works. We will cover Dreams Come True, the Road, life's Travel, journey, beginnings and a lot of insight and inspiration in between. I am a successful film and television entrepreneur who came to America as a teenager to pursue my show business dreams. Are you ready for some unfiltered real talk with entertainment visionaries from all over the world? Then let's roll sound and action.

Well, hello everyone. On the Heart of Show business, I have with me a legend. You know, when somebody talks about the studio heads, it's always like a scary name the studio head because it's like the enemy. But it's not. We're talking here with Sid Gannis, who has been in the business for quite a bit of time. We're not going to say how long, but he has been the president of the Academy for four years. He was president of Paramount Pictures back in the day when they greenlit Topgown and fatal attraction. He has had his own independent production company. He was chairman of Columbia. He was based at Sony with his production company. He's done movies from every side of the spectrum, from like the Duke Spigolo, which I love, by the way, the B inspirational movies, like documentary, second Olympia Dukakis. You know, pan Am, the TV series. I want to hear about Margot Robbie because she's Barbie. There's so much to talk about. So, sid, welcome to my show.

Alex, first of all, thank you very much. Second of all, not long ago somebody said how long you've been in the. You just said he'd been in the business a long time. Somebody said how long you've been in the business, so I counted. I'm so glad you're not telling anybody how long I've been in the business. Thank you very much. I can't believe it.

What I say. You were there back in the days where the studio system was actually not broken and and wonderful movies were coming back out there not just superhero movies and you're championing the storytellers and it was just like a different world where producers had manners and had education. I'm sorry new producers, but it was quite not going to go there. So it's just so great to, but tell me something because I'm curious, like how did you get started? Because obviously you come from New York and then you just get on a plane and come to LA and say I'm going to be a movie producer or a studio executive. How did I?

I'll tell you, but before I tell you, can I tell you something else, please, yes, please. Of course you get that. I was there back in the day when people were polite and the studios were, you know, different, and all that it's true. What you just said is true, but a lot of it is true. Today too, we're seeing publicly, social media wise, we're seeing, I think, the very worst of it, and you're saying, back then they were really good movies. Today they're really good movies. You know what I saw the other day? I'm probably, I'm definitely going to answer your question, but before I do. The other day, you know, I, my wife Nancy and I live in the Bay Area, so, sure enough, there are Academy screenings in the Bay Area. Every every week there's an Academy screen. The other day We've seen, you know, the big ones have been through lately and they've been great. And then the other day I saw the Benage Julia Benage movie, brand new movie, lovely movie. Now, of course I can't think of the title of that lovely movie, but a small little beautiful movie that came out of France. Of course, I think it had some US producers also, so it works always. You know, yes, back then they were terrific movies, god knows, you were terrific movies, but they were also the craziest, strangest, you know, most exploitive movies back then, just like today. They weren't big superhero movies, of course, back then. Well, I mean Buster Crabb, as as Tarzan, I guess he was a superhero in his day. Anyway, that's not how I got started.

That's not.

I was born and bred in Brooklyn, new York. Really a long time ago. I am, you know, aging now and I was us, you know, just amazed at what I would see, both in the local movie theater where I would walk to as a kid. We could do that. We walked to. I think the first, one of the first movies I saw was the Third man of all things. What was I doing? A little kid I must have been 10 years old watching the Third man, but I walked to it and paid my 25 cents kids in the day, so I was always fascinated by it. Went to local high school James Madison High School, with a whole bunch of other people who wound up and show business. Nobody can tell you why, don't understand why. And then Brooklyn College. And I wasn't doing very well in Brooklyn College. I didn't quite know why I was there, so I quit. And I came home and I said to my mother Mom, I quit school, I quit Brooklyn College. And she said OK, sidney, now what are you going to do? And because I was just a kind of a little Jewish kid from Brooklyn with a nice family, I wasn't thinking about what I was going to do, but I did answer an ad, a want ad in those days in the newspaper that said Office Boy wanted in show business publicity office must want to be in show business and I thought, hmm, seems like a good thing to try and I answered that ad. And then, alexia, this is a little bit of where luck comes into life I answered the ad that sent a letter, which I did, and back in those days I sent a letter and I got a response and the response was thank you, but we filled the job. I took that paper and put it on the kitchen counter in our apartment. And it's so happened that that afternoon or the next afternoon, my uncle, my uncle Phil and my aunt Estelle came over to visit, because that's what we did. Family just didn't knock, didn't call, I mean didn't book in advance. They just came over and Uncle Phil said what are you doing, sid? And I said well, I'm trying to get a job. Uncle Phil and I said here, look at this. I tried to get a job with this, this firm, this guy. And my uncle Phil looked at the letter, alexia, that he the rejection letter, the one that said we filled the job, and he said I know that guy, there's your story. That's how I got started in show business. Wow, office boy, you know, $50 a week, office boy. I did it and and got the coffee and went for the stuff and delivered the copy to the New York Times and the Daily Mirror and those it and was totally taken with it and really and truly that's the way I got my start. It was one of the biggest PR firms too, so I think that you lucked out, because that's least all there is right, exactly, you know that Exactly, it was Lee Salters firm Salt is called Salters O'Rourke and Savinson in those days and yes, I was the office boy for Salters O'Rourke and Savinson Exactly. I don't even think that term exists today, Office boy.

You know this is a testament to what we're talking about, the good old days. Well, there's still good old days now there's good new days. But I also started, you know, in the business and I wanted to learn everything about international sales. And they're like I speak a lot of languages and I, even though I had done a few markets, I got hired at a small company and I, like we're looking for a sales person to help us with sales Guess what? I was vacuuming, I was answering the phones, I was talking to labs to talk about deliverables. I was course putting telexists together with the course I wasn't going. Well, I have to rule the world. I'm not paying my dues, and I think in today's generation, they want everything so fast, and that's something that I think I love. What you just said, you know it's yes, we have to learn everything, but we also have to work hard.

Yes, I mean yes, Uncle Phil started me off, but of course I had to love it, be passionate about it, work it. You know, not even think about hours and just do the job. And I think you said a minute ago you think things are moving so fast and young men and women who are in the business or wanting to be in the business today have to understand that what you did and what I did is the way to do it. For goodness sakes, it is the way to do it. And, yes, there's a lot more to absorb. I think, well, maybe it's the same old stuff that just has different veneer to it. I think it is because you know why we're storytelling and selling our stories and marketing our story. I think it's the same, except with different elements, different veneer to it. No, be patient, do the work. You know, no matter how long we talk today, Alexa, what's going to happen is I'm going to say the same thing. That's what we have to do and that's what young people have to do today. Get a sense of, get the feel of all of it around you.

Yes, absolutely. And as we said even before we pushed record, people have to learn the business. It's not just I'm a speed writer, I'm a producer, I'm a director. Right, Tell me more about that.

Well, you know, I mean, it was me. I can only speak it the way I did it and it's what I tell to my friends, kids these days, who are very interested in this. I say, you know, don't think of it, as I just want to be a production designer. Yes, you do want to just be a product designer, but to be a really good, complete production designer, you also have to know about. You know what the grips are doing and what the you know the writers are doing and how to produce, because you're producing as a production designer. So don't just go this way, kind of go this way. Spread out, be curious about everything you can absorb in the business and today, of course, as I say, it's complicated by the media, the social media and and all of the information that's moving around so quickly and also, if you want to be in the production side of the business, also be curious about international sales. Goodness knows and I've been, you know, I've been around long enough to have directors who are interested in international sales and not interested in international sales. But I'm using international sales and the example. I have a great story to tell you about that and it goes back to the old days. You want to hear it, yes, please, about the only Kubrick of all things. Way, way, way, way, way back I worked at Columbia Pictures in New York City. It was one of my first jobs. My first job was with Saltis. My first job in the movie business was at 20th Century Fox and my second job was at Columbia Pictures and at Columbia Pictures I was in the publicity department in. I wasn't the big shot. I was in the publicity department doing publicity, learning, loving it, meeting people, getting to know people, and we had this movie called Doctor, strange, love and Kubrick. In those days I think he was living in London already he's from the Bronx, but I think he was living in London and certainly he came back to New York after he finished the movie in London, after he finished Strange Love in London, and came back to Columbia in New York City and I got to know him and we worked together, as did many others in the department. But here's what I want to tell you about this guy who knows what he's doing, not only about the movie he's making but about what's happening, and I promise you this is a true story. One day in the hallway he said not to me but to a guy in charge of handling advertising around the country. In those days newspaper advertising was very important. You'd advertise in newspapers, you would begin to advertise on television, but still the newspaper ad was a big thing. So Kubrick said to this very nice man, lenny Byer, he said and what about Cleveland? We were opening in Cleveland. And Lenny said, yeah, we're opening in Cleveland, and here's the opening ad, and here's the Monday, tuesday, here's the Wednesday ad and we'll have the big Friday ad. And Kubrick said I promise you, I couldn't believe my ears. He said that Wednesday ad isn't that too big for Wednesday. He saved it and put some of that money into someplace else. He knew and he cared and he was willing to have an opinion about advertising in Cleveland Ohio.

Wow.

The ad in the Cleveland Plain dealer or something like that. Isn't that amazing. That is a lesson for me back then. A real lesson for me.

Yeah, it's such an amazing story because, again, people are forgetting that this is, this is global storytelling more than ever. So you need to know not just about how to have success in the three key cities in the United States. You have to know how to have success in the small towns in the USF, how to have success overseas Jordan Right, gonna translate, and I know and I wanted to ask you because you have had such a varied body of work as a producer. I mean, you go from really funny comedy like a do speak a little. Then you go and go and produce a Kayla and the B, which is an inspirational story. So what is it that makes you say yes when you see something as a producer? What is it that you get, like the hairs on your arms, standing up and saying I have to get behind this project.

There was. There was a word that we used to use that may not be in the vocabulary anymore, I'm not sure With all of the information that we have coming from everywhere. There was. A term is probably ancient. I'm sure many of your viewers and listeners probably would say what's he talking about? So the answer to your question is my gut. G U T. My gut helped me along, helps me along the way to this day. I promise you I'll listen to the research and I promise you I'll dig into the statistics and the box office and the previous stuff. But also when I'm certainly when I'm reading a script, it's, it's what moves me on the page. And I got to tell you a Kila and the B do speak low, also in its own way. I mean, you couldn't have picked two diverse examples of my work. Do speak low, you know, in all its silliness and craziness. You said you liked it. It had a good story for women, I thought, and my wife, who reluctantly saw it when it was finished, said, oh, that's pretty good. And Akilah and the B. From when I first heard about it I just knew I wanted to make that movie. And then the other big part of this on Akilah, especially my wife Nancy. I mean, you know I said, nancy, please read this. As I once said to her when I was at Paramount, please read ghost. You know plenty of other people were, you know, reading and giving me their opinions and all that, but my wife's opinion I pay attention to it. I don't always go with it, but I certainly pay attention to it. And when she read Akilah and the B, she said, oh God, yeah, let's, let's do it. And we did, the two of us did it together.

Wow, and you know my.

God G U T.

I live by it said I live by my God. I always say intelligence is not here and because it never fails you, how many times have we are? I should have listened to my God? We both say that why didn't I listen to my God? But you know I love what you said that your wife enjoyed Do speak alone. And one of the reasons why I enjoyed it, beyond the campiness of Rob Schneider and all of it, was the message that every woman is deserving of love. That to me, the fact that this guy would go out with all this different kind of needed to be seen and value. That's that's why we go. When we see films that they have great success, you know, like the book club or or the miracle, I mean those are the stories that, even though, well, those were a little bit more niche than obviously do speak alone. But and I kill and the be, I mean to be making such a diverse movie in not a diverse time. That's got to have to be groundbreaking for you. I mean, did you have to get a lot of rejection because obviously those big old as easier to set up, because you got Rob Schneider and all that campiness?

And and can produce it. So you know yeah yeah, a lot going for it. Yeah, I feel that it was a rough go. But, alexia, this is the game, this is where you, if you believe, really, truly believe in it and you have enough intestinal fortitude to stick with it, it might happen, and in the case of Akila it happened, but it happened in a little bit of a strange way. Again, luck came into it a little bit. You wanna hear?

Yes, I love it.

Like you told me before, when we were talking, before we started, I said before we started shooting, but I wish it were on a set right now, before we started talking about just about how you kind of never know in this business. And you said you worked for Lionsgate and so I'd been around with the script. We'd been around with the script and, yes, it was a very good script from the beginning and we were rejected time and time again On the script alone. We had no elements other than the script. On the script alone. We were told no, we said it's the same old thing that you would expect as any financier to say you want me to finance a picture about a little African American kid from South Los Angeles which is a spelling bee? What are you kidding At Lionsgate? I sent it. I have two friends at Lionsgate, the guys who many years later are still running the company, john Feldheimer and Michael Burns. But Michael Burns had young kids, felt had older kids. So I sent it to Michael. I said, michael, just have a look at this over the weekend. Well, michael handed the script to his assistant and said please, you know, asked her to read it over the weekend and she came back to Michael Burns and said you gotta do this movie. Who knows?

Who would have thunk it?

Who would have thunk it?

Those are the great stories. I mean, you know my buyers. Some of my buyers financed a pre-bought lullaline when Patrick was going around talking about it. Tammy and Chazelle and they were gonna give him all this money to make this movie from making a smaller film, you know. And now he wanted $4 million just on the opening scene on the freeway and this and that. But you know, there are the people like you and the Patrick's of the world and the Mark Damon's and the Arnold Coppins of course. If you know Mike Meta Boys and the Mario Casars and those people who believe in the vision. We've known them all in the ambivanias. I had the pleasure of meeting them.

Good for you. What a bunch of great names.

My gosh. I mean, I honestly got more starstruck, to be honest, to talking to you than it would be to just talking to you, whatever the guy who made the hottest for a movie of the moment, because you're giants and you've seen it all and we are right now in a business that is changing so much and you know the elephant in the room we're in the midst of a strike and I do. You have a viewpoint about this? Because obviously, ampts and other work don't call us producers, don't call us what's going on, like. Why is this not getting resolved in Europe?

Well, first of all, alexa, I hope when this airs, when this podcast airs, the strike is so over and people are saying you know that was terrible, but here we are now. But here we are now and it's very disheartening. I, you know, I've been around, like you say, and I love the business and I love the people in the business. This one is a rough one, really, really, really rough. Part of it is because everybody's angry at everybody else. Part of it is because everybody's angry and the anger, anger is out there. It's not personal anger, it's not people sitting in a room screaming and yelling at each other. It's, you know, social media and the trades and you know, and the gossip guys reporting the yelling and screaming and that's no good. And you know, people say in the old days there was Lu Wasserman, but today there are plenty of men and women smart on the studio side. Every single one of the men and women who are on the studio side are terrific. They know this stuff and their state's people as well. And on the WGA side and on the actor side it's the same thing. They're a good, wise people ready to negotiate. It's baffling almost to see how it doesn't seem to be happening at the moment, this very moment, including this morning, when, you know, there was something damning I read, but remember I was reading it just the way. I was complaining about reading it a minute ago. I was reading it on social media. So it's got to end and it can end. Of course it can, and it doesn't matter that there's AI and streaming and residual issues. Those are issues. They're resolvable issues. They are resolvable. People have to sit in a room and talk directly to each other. Not just talk, but negotiate directly with each other, and it can be done. I wonder, as I'm saying this to you, alexia, I wonder. I can't imagine. No, I know I was about to say I wonder if people are not willing to negotiate. No, the people we're talking about are. But in the meantime, people are hurting all over the place. The last writer strike 2007, or eight or something like that. I was smack in the middle of it. I was an independent producer, but I had just come from the studios and I knew the game and I was president of the Academy. And guess what? In 2008, I had to put on a show, so I needed the writers to be willing to give me a waiver. I had to go to them hat in hand and ask for a waiver. And there's a way to do that, alexia. There's a way to do it, I got it. So there must be a way to do it. And the writers were allowed to write in a minimal way. I think I forget what the deal was Bye. This is horrible and hurtful, and the writers deserve what they want to appoint, as do the actors, of course they do. And the studio guys. I can't imagine Mr Iger and all of them. But I point to Iger because I said Lou Wasserman's name before and Iger is the closest thing to Lou Wasserman today. I think Bob knows, he knows. So I'm only hoping you know, I don't know. I can't say anything more because I don't know anything more. I don't know what the solution is. But, as I said, by the time this podcast airs, this thing better be over. You know why? Don't even air it. If it's not over, we won't be an industry anymore.

This is. You are so right, Sid, and unfortunately, as I'm hearing it in well, let's hope that by the time it airs, I'm going to say what the hell were they talking about? Fake news, because I am hearing in May drag until January or February, because all this, like you say, anger. And the thing is that what is upsetting me is, again, I stand by the fact that writers should get more actors. They deserve to have their residuals but at the same time, what about all the other people?

Oh God.

All the producers going out of business. You know the craft service, and they're so fixed on finding their own battle, their own single battle, that they're like, well, those are just going to be. It's for everybody? No, it's not for everybody, because everybody's hurting. And you know and I was talking to a friend of mine just he's actually coming on my podcast I'll send you the link, you know in a few weeks and he will say I get asked for residuals by SAG before I even paid my investors or the banks that I borrowed money from.

Can't be.

And he can have and then at the same time, studios Okay, everybody's talking about Bob Iger. It's a big, like every studio had. They live in some like private islands with five you know planes and 25 Ferraris and it's like again, they're bunching everything together and I don't believe. Oops.

My wife just walked in. That's great. My partner, the woman we were talking about before.

Exactly Believe that every studio had is greedy and they don't want people to get paid. I don't believe that and you know because you've been one, so you would right.

No, we want it to be fair. We will and it can be, and at the moment it's not. And God, I hope you're wrong or not you're wrong, but what you've heard is wrong and it's not going to be January or February. That would be horrifying. Hey, my son in law is a prop man, so I know the feeling. My son in law is a prop man. Right now he's getting paid, but he's not a happy prop man.

No, no and it's. And, like I said, I mean we've all got to come together and talk. You know how many times have we all talked about you know studio movies and we don't get a residuals even before this and we go oh, it's creative accounting of the stupid. You know the P and a money and all that. I guess nobody will get angry like this. The anger, and how social media is exploiting all this to incinerate even more the parties is not a healthy way to go. And praying for you, for me, for you know the transportation coordinator, of course, everybody you know to get back to work because we just came out of COVID and it's like couldn't you know my grandson, couldn't we wait a year? We're just coming out of COVID, you know, but I mean that said what's coming next for you said I mean, do you still love producing? Are there still things that you don't have to talk to me about? What they're about? Obviously, because stuff it's confidential. But is there stuff that still fires you up and says I want to keep going?

I remember I said to you about five minutes ago I made a mistake and said I alluded to the fact that I was on a set instead of on this podcast. I'd love to be on a set again, probably not the same way I used to be, but I'd love to be. Yes, and the good news is, the very good news, is that voice you heard before my wife, who just came in, is, you know, she'll be the next one on the set and I'll be kind of hanging around with her on the set, you know. So, yeah, this is not over for me, but just now I finished a documentary about a Japanese artist called Yoshiki, which is going to open in September, going to start in September. And then there's another documentary I'm working on about trafficking, human trafficking, kids, and it's coming along nicely too, and it too is going to be on one of the streaming services. So, yeah, but do I want to do a big ass feature again? Yeah, sure, be nice, but Nancy might be doing that very thing.

Well, I think we're all at it. I always say you know, I'm never going to stop. I'm never going to stop, you probably won't.

You know why? Because you're a good Greek. That's why, and good Greeks, don't stop.

The Greeks, the Greeks and the Jews. They never stop. And you got the both.

I got both.

Me too, from great grandfathers in Russia. So, yes, we never stop, and I think this is what I want to tell to all the filmmakers, because one of the things that impressed me with said, and shout out to our friend Rick Berman, who was my student I'm sure he told you in a class that I taught about pitching yeah, he did, yeah, he loved it. And he told me you were so generous to him and you picked up the phone and you told him your thoughts on your script. That is such a rarity and I am so grateful that you are on this podcast to share your wisdom. I mean, I think you need to write a book. That's my two cents, because I said we probably won't have enough. We will have more to say. So maybe talk about you might want to write a book, you know, and if not, I'll have to bring you back, maybe after the strike is over. Okay, we can come up with new things and new everything, but no, sid, thank you so much for coming on my show. I'm just soaking it up. I want to hear more and I'm sure my listeners will, and you know to everyone. You know, of course, if you enjoy the episode, please subscribe, rate, review, look up some of Sid's work. He needs his residuals, just as I do. Yeah, right. So if you want to go see again and Olympia and do Spigolo and Pan Am, wherever you're going to catch it somewhere, keep watching. Sooner or later we'll get our 20 cents in the mail and we'll be waiting for the hosts into this episode. So thank you, sid. Thank you for coming on the show.

You're welcome, Alexia, of course.

And that is the Heart of Show business, over and out.

Yeah.